Leah: [00:00:00] Welcome to another episode on the Balancing Busy Podcast. I’m Leah Remay, and today I have maybe my favorite guest I’ve ever had in my whole life because it happens to be my own daughter. So Ella is on the podcast with me. Hey, Elle. Hi, I’m so excited to get to be on the podcast with you, mama. Okay, so we decided that we wanted to do this episode because a, Ella is home from college.

She’s been at college at Brigham Young University for the last year, and she’s home for just a little bit and we thought it would be so fun to just talk about really kind of her experience. I started my business when Ella was three. So her, as far as her memories go. She cannot remember a time when her mom did not work and didn’t have a business.

So I thought we could kind of talk about. You know, in all honesty, some of the mistakes I made, some of the things I got right and just have a [00:01:00] conversation that hopefully can help other moms no matter what stage you’re at. So Ella, let’s start by talking about, I have worked as far as you can ever remember.

So can you kind of share, you and I were talking as we were brainstorming, and one of the questions I asked you was how, how much do you remember? Feeling like mom’s working or like seeing me work. So let’s just start there and then we’ll, we’ll kind of keep going. 

Ella: Yeah. So I always, I always knew you worked.

I mean, I always knew you had a business, you always talked about it, but I definitely feel like you did a really great job of keeping work and family life separate and spending a lot like. You split the time really well, where I never, ever felt neglected or anything. I felt that you always, when I got home from school, [00:02:00] most of the time you were done working for the day and you could hang out and you might have like snacks out for us.

Um, the only time. I, I remember you having calls and stuff and I would hate having to be quiet for those. Yes. 

Leah: Oh, I hated trying to keep you guys quiet. I remember that too. Especially when you guys were little. 

Ella: Yeah. We were normally promised candy or some other treat if we were quiet. Yep. And I remember, um, when we lived.

In Western Washington where it rains all the time. And I remember one day it was really beautiful out in the morning, so none of us wore coats to school. But then that app, when school was over, it was pouring down rain. And normally you would come pick us up if there was rain, but you didn’t sew. And we would walk home every other day.

But if there was rain, you’d pick us up. But. You never showed up. So we walked home and you were just so engrossed in a project and we were not happy ’cause we were sopping 

Leah: wet. I remember [00:03:00] that too. And Ella’s being sweet ’cause that did happen more than once. Not, not lots of times, but it definitely happened, you know, probably two or three times and oh my gosh, you guys, they do not let me forget it.

Like, they all bring that up and remind me and they’re like, you left us. And, and it’s true. Like, the one thing about me is I, do I get. So engrossed in my work, like once I’m in it, hours can go by, and that was why it was so important for me to have. Timers that went off, alarms that went off to be very, very scheduled because I knew it would be so easy for me to get sucked into work and not be available for the kids the way that I wanted to show up.

So it’s funny because, you know, I do all these systems and automations and everything I talk about is balanced. But I think sometimes people misunderstand and think, oh, that’s just ’cause it’s my natural. And that’s not, it’s because it is absolutely not my natural state. And so I [00:04:00] needed to create all of these structures for myself so that I could protect myself from being the version of me that I knew I would end up having a lot of regrets with.

So, okay, so we know that I. Forgot to come pick you up a few times or it actually, that’s not even true. I didn’t forget, I never looked out the window. That’s the problem. Yeah. She just didn’t realize it was raining. I had no idea. Like, I hear them come in, I, I can remember, I hear you guys coming in and you’re making so much noise and you’re like.

Ah. Like, you know, and, and I’m like, come out. And I’m like, what? And they are just dripping wet, like dripping wet. And I didn’t even realize it had been raining. I had no idea. ’cause I was so into, you know, whatever work project I was working on that like I had, I had no idea. Okay, so I don’t know how well you are gonna remember this, but the first.

Program that I ever created was called the Thriving Photographer. I know you, of [00:05:00] course, Elle know that, but do you remember in those last stages of me creating the thriving photographer when I was like getting ready for launch and I sat you guys all down and I like promised to buy you toys if you 

Ella: Yeah, I was promised.

Uh. An American girl doll, me and my sister, we were both promised American girl dolls if we would stay quiet and let you record your lessons. And I thought that was a great deal. 

Leah: I, I was happy. Yep. Yep. So there were definitely times where. Uh, I needed you guys’ help and I think that’s a really important distinction.

I tried really hard to make it feel like I didn’t work right. I tried when, once you all three were in elementary school, I really worked to keep my work hours only between those times when you were at school, and I still made sure I was in each of your classrooms every week. Like I didn’t want you guys to feel that.

But there were times, and I think this is its own important lesson, like there were times where there was nothing I could do about it. You’re [00:06:00] home for the summer or you’re home, you know, ’cause it’s another random day off for school. I remember I used to be like, oh my gosh, how are there this many days off?

’cause I couldn’t take the day off. And there were times where I needed you guys’ help so I could finish things. And by needing your help, I mean like I needed you to stay preoccupied and pretty quiet. And that was definitely one of ’em when I was trying to record all those. Videos and, and all the audio tracks for that course.

And I don’t even think Payson would’ve been in school yet. I mean, I don’t, yeah, I don’t think all three of you were even in school yet. I think you were. You were still so little. 

Ella: Yeah. I think you promised him Thomas the train. Yeah. 

Leah: Yeah. I think you’re right. That’s so funny. Okay, so looking at having a working mom.

What are things that you would say at the time maybe you didn’t love, but now you’re glad for? Or even things that you just didn’t love and you still don’t love, or just [00:07:00] things that that you think have been either good or bad? 

Ella: Yeah. I don’t think this is necessarily like having to do with having a working mom, but one thing you definitely did is you pushed me a lot to face my fears.

Because anyone who knows me knows I can be a little anxious mess at times, and it was pretty bad when I was younger, like I couldn’t even ask for ketchup. I. At a restaurant that was terrifying, but I remember you making me do those things. He’d be like, Nope, I’m not asking for you. You have to ask. Or are you making me order my own food?

And I was so mad. I was like, why would you do this to me? You’re mean mom. But now as I’m older, I’m so grateful because it definitely helped squash that fear. Or at least even when still I’m. I can [00:08:00] get my own ketchup now, but I’m glad you 

Leah: clarified that for everyone. Like just in case they weren’t sure.

You’re like, just in case you were wondering, I can’t 

Ella: get my own ketchup. 

Leah: I’m so proud of you. 

Ella: Thank you. You sure. But, but just other things, bigger things like at college, going to things by myself, um, when my roommates didn’t wanna go. Or maybe, um, having to communicate with my professors, things that are scary, but I am more ready to face those things.

And it’s, 

Leah: it’s not as scary as it used to be. No, I love that you’re saying that because there really was some guilt that I felt when I would be like, I remember, there’s a couple things I can remember. I remember I think you really wanted like teriyaki or something. And I was like, I will get you teriyaki, but you have to call and order it.

And you were [00:09:00] like so upset, like just so crushed, like, just do this for me. And I was like, no. And I remember feeling like. I just worrying that, you know, I, I think moms spend so much time worrying about am I doing the right thing or not? Mm-hmm. And it can be really easy to. To default to the in instant comfort, right?

Like, oh, instead of making this hard, I’m gonna try to smooth the path. I’m gonna make it a little bit easier. But in the long run, that wouldn’t have been the best thing for you. And trying to keep that perspective as a parent can be so hard. And I remember. So vividly when you were at college this last year, you calling me because you were walking to an activity and none of your roommates could come, and you were like, yeah, I’m gonna go by myself.

And I just remember being in awe and being like, who is this Ella, like the, the Ella that wouldn’t even get ketchup. Like you would’ve rather go without. Then have to make a phone call or go ask [00:10:00] for ketchup or whatever it is. And then here’s this girl who’s like, I’m just gonna go to the activity all by myself.

Because I, it wasn’t even something like super exciting. It was. I I actually, it was a service project. It was Crochet Club. It was crochet club. You are, I’m that cool. It was, it was crochet club. ’cause you’re so stinking cute. My little, yeah. So, so Ella is like my little. She’s like my little grandma. She loves to crochet and cross stitch.

Her favorite candy are those little hard worders originals. Not even the soft, yummy ones. It’s the hard ones. The ones that grandma’s carry around. This is, this is what Ella loves. Nothing 

Ella: beats Grandma Candy. 

Leah: It’s awesome. It’s awesome. Okay. What else do you feel like, um, what else do you feel like has really helped you?

Ella: You definitely put an emphasis on us learning to be. Self-sufficient, like doing our own laundry and making dinner once a week and keeping our rooms clean. [00:11:00] And you would help occasionally, but for the most part it was like if, if you don’t do your own laundry, if you don’t clean your room, then you have no clothes and you live in a messy room.

And once I got to college once again, I was really grateful for that because I mean, there was no struggle. Doing my own laundry or I did pretty good at keeping my room clean, um, which was also because I had a roommate and I didn’t want her to hate me. Um, or like every, um, for a long time growing up, every week you would have us make a dinner once a week.

And I distinctly remember the first dinner that I made really, and I don’t know if you’ll remember it. No, I don’t. What. I got all the recipes out of the unofficial Harry Potter cookbook. 

Leah: I am starting to remember this now. 

Ella: Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I made an [00:12:00] entire roast chicken. Yep. And I was so proud of myself ’cause it was a freaking roast chicken and I made it.

And I made homemade rolls and I made mashed potatoes and I made salad and I was so proud of myself and it felt so good. And then now when I was at college, I had so many recipes in my repertoire. Repertoire. 

Leah: Yeah, yeah, 

Ella: yeah. I had so many recipes that I knew how to make and my roommates would be like, you’re always making such fancy food.

And I’m like, yeah, it’s ’cause my mom would always have us make a dinner once a week. And I was Yeah. Grateful for that. 

Leah: So I’m, I’m glad It’s so interesting hearing each of these things because you would have no idea. But I remember the guilt I felt about each of these decisions. Mm-hmm. And so being able to now see all the years later and looking back and realizing how beneficial it was, the honest truth is l the reason I made you guys do laundry was ’cause I did not have time.

Right. Like, I don’t know if I can honestly say, [00:13:00] I was thinking, I wanna help the kids to be self-reliant. I did know that that was a huge goal of mine and I had thought a lot about that since you were really little. But it was more like self-preservation and just the need of, I couldn’t do everything all the time.

It just wasn’t possible when I had this company and trying to be a great mom and all the different things. And so, you know, I remember just thinking. I need to make them do their own laundry because this is taking way too much time. And then feeling all the mom guilt of really good moms don’t make their kids do the laundry and their kids come home to like clean clothes folded on their beds.

And my kids come home to, well, I guess you have no underwear if you go laundry. Right? And then even the same thing with dinner. It, it really was desperation that initiated starting having you guys make dinner because. I was so tired of the guilt that I [00:14:00] felt coming out of work at the end of the day, which would be right as you were coming home.

Yeah. It was usually either just a few minutes before if I managed to get your snack ready before you got home, or it was like I could hear the door and so I would immediately pop up and walk down the hall to greet you. And so you get done at whatever time that is, maybe three in the afternoon and all of a sudden it hits me, oh my gosh, I forgot to pull something outta the freezer for dinner.

And I have, which it’s so funny ’cause now I look back and I’m like, Leah, why didn’t you just pull out multiple things at once? That’s what I do now. Like now I have multiple different meats in the fridge, like right for the different dinners for the week. But for some reason back then I never thought of that.

So it was night after night after night of no plan for dinner. Once again, I had forgotten to pull something out. Once again, I wasn’t ready. Once again, I felt really guilty and had all the mom guilt of I am. Not prioritizing. Right. And so it was like this moment of desperation of like, you know what? You guys are gonna cook.

You’re each getting a night of the week. And so then all of a sudden it was like, great, three nights are done [00:15:00] and this is gonna make my life so much easier. But it has been so fun seeing the confidence that you each have in the kitchen. Mm-hmm. And you know, you and your sister each being out of the house and me having no worry.

I knew there was gonna be so many things that were scary and new, but I knew you each knew how to clean. You each knew how to cook. You each knew how to do your own laundry. Like there were things that I knew weren’t going to baffle you in any way, which felt really good. 

Ella: Yeah, and honestly, I really appreciated you showing me like sometimes you can’t do everything.

Sometimes you can’t do everything for everyone, because especially at college when you’re trying to balance. Social with school, with doing your chores, with like making yourself dinner, all the different things where you’re trying to balance it all. It really, like I knew sometimes you can’t do everything and there’s [00:16:00] absolutely nothing wrong with that.

And sometimes I had to have cereal for dinner and I felt bad because I was taking a nutrition class and I’d have to write down what I ate and I’d be like. It’s just really sad today, but I just can’t with it. But I appreciated seeing you. Show me like you don’t have to constantly be doing all the things like you can, sometimes things can get a little messy and that’s fine.

I, 

Leah: I mean that feels amazing to hear because. I don’t know if I’ve ever thought of it like that, if I’m being totally honest. I think I always was kind of trying to hide from you guys. Maybe like, no, look, mom’s fine. She’s doing it all, and it’s okay that it slipped through the cracks and that you could see that there were things I had to let go because that lesson is so important, and I think that’s a lesson that I wish I would’ve personally learned sooner and given myself permission.

Earlier to not [00:17:00] constantly think that I needed to be everything for everyone all the time. I felt like in the early years of my business, I didn’t see that. So to know that, like you’ve seen, that feels really good. Yay, yay, yay. Okay. Yay. Let’s, um, well, okay. First let me ask you this. Is there anything else that you can think of that you’re like, I did not like that you did this at the time, but I’m glad you did it now.

Ella: I mean, there’s a lot of different things that I needed in the moment. Every single phone call you made me make, I hate phone calls. I can do them now, but if I can avoid it, I’ll avoid it. I’m, I’m not gonna, but at least you can do it 

Leah: now. 

Ella: I can do it now. And then I get off the phone and I’m like, that was exhausting and I hated that, but I can do it.

Leah: Okay, so for every mom out there who has a kiddo. Like you, who is terrified [00:18:00] to make the phone call or ask for ketchup at the restaurant or go into the grocery store and pick something up, what? What would you say to her? 

Ella: I would say it, it feels really bad in the moment, making your kid do this and your kid’s gonna feel bad and they might even be mad at you.

There were plenty of times I was really mad at you. I was like. This, I can’t believe you do this to me. This is so mean. But I am really grateful now and I mean, I remember the first time, like I. You didn’t even have to prompt me to ask for something. I just was like, excuse me, can I have more of this? And I remember you, I was 10 or something and you started crying.

That sounds like me. I’m such, she was just so proud of me. So it may, it, it’s gonna really suck while you’re trying to get past that [00:19:00] fear. But then once you see the growth. And once you see them overcoming those hurdles, that’s when you, the mom, guilt goes away and you start to feel really good about it.

Yeah. 

Leah: Yeah, that’s true. That’s true. ’cause it was really hard in the moment when you’re like crying and begging me to not make you do the thing right. When you were little and, um, and trying to navigate and find, I think one of the things as a mom is you’re trying to follow, like this intuition of when you need to push and when you need to let them, right?

There were times when I knew like I needed to push you, but there were. Other times where I actually knew and I felt like it was just this little, like just let her, right? Like there was just this little moment where it was like, just do it for her. Just it’s right now she’s at her limit. And so even trying to navigate that was its own trick to try to figure out, [00:20:00] but probably it was very rare.

To have the feeling of, no, I just need to let her, the majority of the time I needed to push you. Which, yeah, we always want you guys to like us, so when you’re mad at us it doesn’t feel good and you know, we wanna avoid that. But long term we can clearly see you now can get your own ketchup. We have made great strides and it was all good.

One 

Ella: thing I remember, or just something that’s I think about is sometimes you’d be like, say things like. If you, you have to order your own food because I was terrified to order my own food, but then you don’t have to do this. Like, it was just little things at a time. Yeah, you might make me call in the food, but you’re not gonna make me walk into the store and pick it up, because that also terrified me.

Or if you called it in, I had to be the one to walk in and pick it up. Just balance. At 

Leah: first I had forgotten about that, but you’re right. Yeah. And I, and I’d let you [00:21:00] have the choice like. Okay. You have to decide. Either you call it in or you pick it up, but you’re doing one of them. That’s right. Yeah. 

Ella: And I think, I think that was good because sometimes it can get too overwhelming where I’m like, I can’t do it all.

Yeah. I can’t do both things. And obviously now I can and I’m really grateful for that. But at the time it just was baby steps. 

Leah: Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So. What we’re talking about is kind of doing hard things. I mean mm-hmm. Hard things is relative to the person, but at that time those did feel hard, right? Yeah.

Like they did. And so how do you feel like you’ve been blessed in doing hard things? And it doesn’t even have to be things I’ve pushed you to do, just doing hard things. 

Ella: Yeah. So I, I definitely have done, um. A lot of hard things over the years where it’s helped me [00:22:00] grow and become stronger. And I think the biggest blessing is I, I feel like I’ve learned not to quit.

I I never really was a quitter. 

Leah: No. Yeah. But 

Ella: like, it’s taught me to just persevere and try and find the positive. Um, and I’m thinking specifically. So, most of you won’t know this, but I did a program called Apple Blossom and it was absolutely amazing. It was a, a, uh, pageant royalty program and it was absolutely amazing, but it was also really freaking hard and I had to go to things and I had to be smiling and in high heels, and I had to look my best and 

Leah: talk to and talk to strangers.

I mean, you were talk to strangers. I didn’t know constantly. Yeah. You were constantly talking to strangers. I remember right after. So Ella, Ella did this her senior year. Yeah. And it was amazing. She was crowned queen [00:23:00] for the 2024 season. 2024, is that right? Yeah, 2024. Okay. Okay. So that gave her a year of a lot of duties.

And I remember shortly after, maybe it was before you were crowned, or it was right after you had to go to the radio station to be interviewed. Yeah. And you were going all by yourself. Like you, you were driving. To the radio station. You had to find where it was, park, go in, figure out where you were supposed to be, and then do this interview.

Mm-hmm. And, and that was another one of those like crazy proud mama moments where, I mean, there was a time when I couldn’t get you to, you know, ask the parking was the scariest part. Yeah. I knew it was, I can get you to, you know, do so many things, but it was all those little steps. Right. It was baby step after baby step of.

Smaller hard things. Yeah. That prepared you for bigger, hard things. 

Ella: And I felt like all through that, you really encouraged me. And there were definitely [00:24:00] times where I’d get really mad at you because I’d just be feeling so like, oh, this is driving me insane. This is a hard, and you’d be like, well, pick your attitude.

And I’m like, it’s not what I wanna hear right now, lady. And I’d be so mad at the time and to this day, whenever, she’s like, well pick your attitude. I’m like. I don’t, I, no, I don’t want to. I want to be mad, but once I get past that, I’m able to figure it out and kinda find the positive. And I feel like the only way you can graduate from dread to finding the positive is by continuously doing hard things.

Leah: That was so quotable. 

Ella: Thank you. 

Leah: I felt good about it. I think you should. I think you should feel really good about that. Okay. So. Final question, having a working mom, do you feel like there’s any parts of it where you can honestly say, this part actually was really hard, that you could maybe help other [00:25:00] moms to maybe not make the same mistake?

Ella: Yeah. Um, I think it, you did a really great job of making sure that you weren’t working when we were home, but. I, I didn’t like it when you, you were working when I’m home, and obviously you can’t always control that. But I think one thing to think about is I could tell occasionally, um, when you had, I even know what you’re gonna say, when, when you had had a hard day, which obviously it’s not, it’s really hard to control that, but I think.

The biggest thing I would say, and I feel like this isn’t what you’re gonna think I’m gonna say okay. But I think instead of trying to, ’cause I could tell when you had a bad day, I could tell when you were actually unhappy and you were trying to fake it, be fake it. I could tell. [00:26:00] And I think instead of doing that, I think it’s okay to say like, I had a really bad day with work.

Can you guys help cheer me up? Can we do something to cheer up Mom? Um, and I think that would’ve been better than just trying to muscle through, because even though for a lot of, um, mom entrepreneurs, your kids may be young. Like if you say Mom needs some cheering up, they’re gonna be like, okay, let me go get my Legos.

This is how much here you want. I’d be like, okay, we can play with my Barbies. That’ll make you happy in a minute, which you love playing Barbies with me, but, but just. Letting your kids know when you’re having a hard day, because I feel like then it helps your kids know that it’s okay to have a hard day, and it’s okay to be upset, but you can 

Leah: find ways to tear yourself up.

That is really good advice. And you’re right, that isn’t the direction I thought you were gonna go. It’s funny because I can think of so [00:27:00] many things. That I did wrong, right? I mean, it’s, it’s easy for me. I definitely think of times when maybe I wasn’t working, but I was so preoccupied, so sure I was there, but I don’t think I was truly present because I was thinking about work projects and deadlines and.

Huge things. So I think about that. I think about times like when I was so into the work I was doing, I didn’t even know it was raining and that you guys were walking home just getting drenched. I think about work trips. I mean, ’cause I had a, I mean I spoke at a lot of conferences and conventions and retreats and there was some of those years where I was, I, I, I would say I took on too many speaking engagements.

And it was like every month I had a different speaking engagement for a while. Mm-hmm. I remember there was one particular kind of season. A lot of times you have speaking engagements are either gonna be fall or spring. Right? Like that’s just when they naturally fall. So it was like I had. Two in October, one in November, one in [00:28:00] September.

I mean, it was just back to back and feeling this guilt of being gone too much, which I don’t know. I don’t know if you have any like memories or thoughts about that You. You probably just thought it was fun. I remember, I don’t know. Remember being 

Ella: upset when you were gone just because I missed you. 

Leah: Okay.

Ella: What excited? Because you would bring me back a present. 

Leah: Yes. That’s mom guilt all the way. Oh, man. I brought you guys back. Stuff like crazy to like 

Ella: try 

Leah: to deal with the mom 

Ella: guilt. No, I felt like that made it better because IWI would’ve been happy to just have you back, but Oh, sure. But I do remember, like, I’d be very sad when I didn’t get to see you.

As much as I wanted. But then we got pizza with Dad. 

Leah: That’s right. That’s right. And And you’d go see movies or something? Movie or he’d take you like mountain biking once, I’d didn’t 

Ella: remember you being out of town. And we went and saw Wreck at Ralph. Okay, there. Well, there you go. It was a dinner theater like the movie and they served you dinner.

It was awesome. [00:29:00] 

Leah: That would’ve been back when we lived in Vancouver, Washington. Yep. That was such a cool theater. 

Ella: I think Dad really helped a lot with that. Where you guys, I knew like you guys were a team. It was like, even though mom’s gone, we still have dad and Dad. Like Yeah. If that makes sense. It does make sense.

Leah: I think that’s a really good point because when, when you were little, and I don’t even know if you could really remember this, ’cause this was like. No, you wouldn’t be able to remember this. This was back in the rental houses before we bought the Christmas tree farm, so I don’t think you would really have these memories.

But my business was taking off. I mean, it had just exploded and so there was not enough hours in the day and dad was in graduate school, right? Like he’s, he’s in chiropractic school and so he was gone. During the whole day. None of you were in school yet. I [00:30:00] mean, we had that, you were in that little preschool, but, um, but like, you know, there was a, a few hours, like what, three days a week or something?

And so there was no way to get it all done. And I was our sole provider. And I remember sitting down with your dad and being like, okay. I need you to take on more. Like, I can’t do this. There’s, I, I just, I was losing my mind. And so we came up with this idea that it was like two or three nights a week he would take over right after dinner.

So, you know, maybe five 30 or 6:00 PM he would take over and I would go into my office and work and he would put you guys to bed. He would, you know, do all the nighttime routine. And it was so hard for me because I could hear you all, and so I would hear one of you having a problem, and I knew exactly how to fix it.

I knew exactly what you needed. I knew where it was. I knew, right, and so at the beginning, I kept coming out to take care of [00:31:00] something, but then I wasn’t getting anything done. So eventually I had to just force myself to be like, it doesn’t matter if you can hear them, you just. Let them figure it out for themselves.

And I didn’t have the insight to understand how powerful that actually was at the time, but it, it really bonded, created the stronger bond with you guys and dad. Because if I’m the one at home, if I’m the one that you always rely on and always go to, I’m the one that knows every. Idiosyncrasy, I know all the intricates of each of you and your needs and you know, even like what different cries mean and what different looks mean and all these things.

And, and dad, he, he wasn’t there so he just couldn’t. Right. Like, this is most dads who have to leave Yeah. All day. And giving him that time at night. He got to learn those things. And then even me going on trips to go speak. [00:32:00] That gave him the chance to spend the weekend with you and get you to all the places and do all the things and, and for you guys to have that bond.

And I didn’t, I didn’t ever think of that at the time. It wasn’t until retrospect where I’ve realized, oh, I’m so grateful you Yeah. Had those moments. 

Ella: And I mean, I’m so grateful too because I feel like I’m equally close with you and dad, and I’m really grateful for that because I know a lot of, um, people who don’t have that relationship with both their parents.

Leah: So I think, okay. I think we, Ella and I were talking about how we should do a couple of episodes and we were kind of brainstorming what the different episodes should be. But I’m thinking this, I think our next episode should be how we’ve been able to build these really close relationships from your perspective.

Because one of the things that was really fascinating that you kept telling me at college was how your roommates would be like. I can’t believe you can talk to your parents about this stuff. Mm-hmm. Like, I can’t believe how close you guys are. And, [00:33:00] and we’ve heard that when your sis had her roommates, we’ve now heard that with Yeah.

Your roommates. Right. And so it would be fun to hear from your perspective, like, how did that happen? How did we manage that? So I think that should be our next episode. 

Ella: I, I agree. Yeah. My roommates did do that. They’d have like a, a question. They’d be like, I don’t feel comfortable asking my mom. Can you ask your mom and then tell me the answer?

I’m like, yep. 

Leah: I love that. That makes my heart happy. Okay, this, I feel like this episode has been amazing, so we are gonna stop here and we’re gonna leave everybody on the teaser that in the future Ella will be back and we’re gonna have another conversation, and then the next one is going to be. About building that like super strong relationship where your kids feel like they can come talk to you about anything and, and from.

A kid’s perspective how, like, how that happened. So that’s coming [00:34:00] up. We’re gonna record it immediately, but I don’t know when it’s gonna go live. ’cause I’m gonna hand this all to my podcast producer and she will make the order. So it may not be for another week or two, but you guys will just keep coming back.

Keep coming back because we’ve got good stuff coming along. All right, Ella, any last words? Um, I love you, mommy. I love you too, baby. Okay. All right. Thank you so much for being part of this episode. Everyone who is here with us, Ella Bean, I love you to the moon and back. You are my favorite thing in addition to your siblings, and I have to say that one, they all love to say, I’m your favorite.

I’m your favorite. They all say that all the time. You’re all my favorites, but I love you to the moon. I’m so glad that we get to have these conversations, [00:35:00] 

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